All smartphones, including iPhones, must have replaceable batteries by 2027 in the EU::undefined
Thank fucking god for the EU, for fighting for global digital rights where nobody else does.
According to republicans Europe is hell on Earth tho
Anywhere that isn’t a fascist theocracy is hell on Earth to many republicans
It’s funny how many of them unironically praise the Taliban. At least, it’s funny from my perspective looking in. I’m sure for a fellow citizen that’s a scary thought.
Fine by me. Nice and cozy 🤗
No wonder, while plenty right wing parties are on the rise here, too, overall people are at least somewhat less removed from actual reality.
mostly cuz EU gives rights and protections to consumers, not corporations
They’re still liberal and give a lot more to corporations than they do people.
And yet to us Americans, we see that the EU does a billion times more for its citizens and we wish our country could be half as good about the things the EU does right.
Grass is always greener…
Actually the Europeans I’ve talked to with a small couple of exceptions very much like their “welfare state” and mainly like America for its entertainment. They do not typically want to live here. I wish I could live in Europe badly
I mean I am European :D I wouldn’t wanna trade either. But there are definitely some people here who still believe in an American Dream or like the idea of earning more and spending less on taxes living in the US. Really depends who you ask.
I understand. Unless you’re lining billionaire pockets and actively hurting the poor, Republicans are PISSED
-for Republicans that is.
One sensible right doesn’t overweight the never-ending bullshit coming from them.
And imo this is not a sensible right. To change a battery in phones is easy even now. All you need is heat gun (hairdryer), new battery, phone tape (2$ ali) and 30 mins of your time…
Also watter resistance will take a hit… I wouldn’t sink my phone under watter with detachable back cover even if it had ip68 by producer. They don’t even cover it in reclamation now.
Compare to how it used to be, removing the battery cover and replacing the battery on the fly. And water resistance with removable batteries has been and can be done. Stop with this nonsense.
One sensible right doesn’t overweight the never-ending bullshit coming from them.
True. Between the private healthcare, abortion rights, school shootings…
Oh wait, you weren’t talking about the US?
We have a fake economy. All investments, researching and efforts could be decided by state (we/public). Protecting society interests and not “investors” interests is an obligation
Does this mean we could potentially order phones from there as US folks?
Doubt Apple will have 2 different devices for each area.
Apple in 2027: This is not a battery, it’s a…umm … Ultra High Density Low Current Super Capacitor.
EU: Ok, then in addition to that UHDLCSC you also need a removable battery.
Yay! Another dongle!
And apple consumers will celebrate it.
they’ll find a place to shove one of these
It might actually force them to develop inductively powered devices or some similar magic
Introducing the UHDLCSC portable charger (which it technically a battery you can attach via USB-C-iLightningSpec©)
Coming soon from Apple. Screws that require a 4D tesseract shaped screwdriver to undo.
But if you can undo them, feel free to change the battery.
I’m sure apple will happily sell you the proprietary tool to turn their proprietary screws for a very reasonable price.
They’re not allowed to do that. The tool design has to be freely available for any manufacturer to fabricate free of charge, they’re not allowed to try and use this as a profit making exercise.
I don’t know why it is that every single time the EU comes up with a law there’s always people in the comments that say it’s a bad law and that they haven’t thought it out, when they’ve not read the documentation. All of the little tricks that the companies might come up with to turn this to their advantage have already being thought of and protected against. This is exactly what happened with the mandating the USB-C port.
Laws being made in good faith and corporations taking advantage of ambiguities or loopholes for “compliance” has been the staple of western corporate lore. I’m sure many of those commenters would love replaceable batteries with usb-c port on their phones too.
Sure but if anybody clicks through to read the article they can see the full wording of the law. It goes on for pages and pages it’s far from ambiguous. This isn’t just something they thought above on a random Friday afternoon this is something that’s been worked on for a few years now.
Yes, but then there’s this decades-long tradition of Lemmy/Reddit/Digg/Slashdot/etc users not reading the actual article and comment based only from headlines often crafted to maximize engagement.
Exactly, the law definitely defines that the tools have to be commonly available with no restrictions or proprietary rights, and that any tools that don’t fit under that definition must be provided free of charge. It also lists a few practices that are outright banned regardless of availability, like needing thermal or chemical tools. They’ve been very thorough.
Ahh yes, screws that can only be unscrewed using The Force
The EU defines user replaceable as you can remove the batteries with common tools. Common tools is defined as a Phillips or flathead screwdriver. So even Nintendo and their stupid try-force screw thing won’t be acceptable.
If that’s really the definition, it’s an awful definition and exactly why we shouldn’t regulate stuff like this. Torx are objectively better than Philips or flathead in every possible way.
As long as the tool isn’t proprietary it’s acceptable. If I can go to a hardware store and buy the interface tool then it’s fine, but it’s not fine if I have to get it from a special manufacturer or if it’s proprietary.
In the case of Nintendo I gave; Nintendo have their proprietary tri-headed screw. They do not make The tri-headed screwdriver publicly available, of course companies have copied them and so you can get one that way, but they’re not official, so my understanding is that that would not be acceptable. Nintendo would have to officially release the tri-headed screw design, and they’re probably just more likely to switch to a different already public screw design.
I also think they are allowed to just glue the batteries in as long as they have pull tabs. Which is probably the better option.
My point is Apple won’t be allowed to just come up with some brand new screw design that no one else has ever seen before. Unless they open source the screw head. In which case I guess it doesn’t matter. But they’re not going to do that because there would be no point.
That’s the reason I bought a set of screwdrivers for apple and there was also the tri-headed included. It was just 5 bucks and I am really happy with them.
Anyway, I just hope they go further in their law like a replacement without any screws. Why not just use the way a laptop battery will be changed? Just click it out easy.
Well if you broaden the definition that much, then it sounds like iPhone batteries are already user replaceable since I can easily purchase the necessary tools from iFixIt.
Again, this is not official. Just because somebody has grogged a way too interface with their proprietary screw heads doesn’t mean that the design is public domain, and the requirement is that the tool set is public domain. Apple’s screw heads are not better than Phillips heads so they’re only doing it to be awkward that’s the point, they’re not allowed to do that anymore. So just because you can technically get the screwdrivers doesn’t make it acceptable.
You’re acting like I’m being unreasonable I’m just telling you what the law is it’s not my fault you haven’t read up on it
I agree that Torx might be better for things that require a lot of torque, but mobile phones?
I just stripped half the screw head in my steam deck because none of my bits would fit just exactly right. I’d have been thrilled about finding torx there.
It’s pre-drilled holes and small screws, Phillips is perfectly fine.
As someone who works with small electronics, Phillips is NOT perfectly fine at small sizes. Below a PH1, the torque required to unscrew a long thread and the torque required to cam-out and strip the head get very close together.
Most batteries are currently held in with some sticky glue, so I’m sure 4 random off the shelf screws would be sufficient. We’re not mounting plasma screen TVs to plasterboard here.
Good thing to wake up to in the morning.
I really don’t like the idea of governments regulating tech and innovations. Although this seems like a good idea, it could severely limit companies in the way they design their phones.
People think that Apple and Samsung maliciously make irreplaceable batteries, but these people barely know how to use their phone in the first place, much less how the phone was engineered. Battery implementation in super thin devices is not a simple affair. Requiring tech to have certain things is really dumb. Let the capitalistic market and buyers figure out what they need. Don’t force it through government.
Agreed. Too bad the 11 disagrees didn’t have the stones to voice their dissenting opinion
Although I am also very much against government control over things and believe that for every one good control law from the government, we get 5 things that infringe upon our rights, I believe this particular legislation is a good one. I don’t think that phone manufacturers maliciously make irreplaceable batteries (although they do many other malicious things, so who knows), but there was a race for thinness back in the mid-2000s when irreplaceable batteries were “invented”; now it’s just inertia. In any case, I can see a demand for fully repairable items and believe that the market is moving in that direction; governments are just pushing it a little.
we can do better than soldered batteries inside unopenable super thin phone cases. These companies have no motivation to innovate any sort of repairability, and now they will have it.
Lol this is such bull shit
It’s not about motivation it’s about need
Nobody is clamoring for this accept the EU government and some right to repair fanatics who most likely don’t repair jack in their own lives and haven’t needed nor requested replacement smartphone batteries
Because nobody needs them anymore lol. Market buddy if this was something important we’d be getting it
Now will companies also offer this in the usa or will they have 2 models for sale
I doubt most companies would bother. Apple is probably the only one with the volume to bother.
True epically since they have a huge share of the American market
I think that would depend on how much EU citizens care about being fully waterproof. I assume there will be focus groups.
If that is a high priority for EU customers, then it will cause Apple to have to do an entire redesign. If they ended up doing that, then I don’t see any reason why they would make a separate US model line. If EU citizens don’t care about waterproof and are fine with it being water resistant, then I could see them having a waterproof non removable US version and an EU version that has removable, but is only water resistant.
There is a real risk that the US eventually follows suit, and there is no reason to re-tool twice if you don’t need to.
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Samsung Galaxy Xcover Pro with removable battery and IP68 entered the chat
Wasn’t the S5 like 67?
Yes, the S5 was IP67. The Xcover Pro is an actual phone with both.
There was/is more than these two examples. You have others like the CAT phones.
I’m not sure anybody really cares about waterproof. I have a waterproof smart watch, but realistically I’m not going to wear it swimming.
Pretty much every phone that I’ve ever owned that has died has died not because it was introduced to some water, but because the battery failed. Cost benefit analysis would indicate that a user replaceable battery is of a higher priority for most consumers. And the rest just won’t care one way or the other.
Anyway the current iPhone isn’t waterproof, it’s only water resistant. Very few companies will advertise their phones is actually waterproof in case somebody tries it.
Waterproofing isn’t important so I can take it swimming; it’s important in case I drop it in a puddle.
The battery on an iPhone is good for about 1000 charge cycles (will maintain at least 85% capacity), which is about 3 years of normal use. After that, it costs like $80 to have Apple replace the battery. That’s absolutely worth it to me for the improved water resistance.
Not a great argument, it’s not impossible to have both. The Galaxy S5 was IP67 and had removable batteries (my favorite phone so far). There is a Galaxy out right now with removable batteries with IP68. Iphones are 67 to 68 depending on the model.
Well in my defense I have no idea what I’m talking about.
I have a water resistant smart watch and I take it swimming all of the time. I see lots of others swimming with smartwatches too. Smart watches are usually fitness tracker. I very much care that the watch is water resistant. I care more about that than having a user replaceable battery, which I’m unlikely to replace given that I never did when replaceable batteries were common in phones.
Though I applaud this as a next step in taking back ownership of that which we buy, I do wonder how this will affect keeping phones dust and water tight, like the IP68 rating…
No doubt an unpopular opinion, but I’d rather keep the IP rating than be able to swap my own battery without the phone becoming a literal brick.
I doubt this is a scenario where we can have both.
You can absolutely have both. In fact the galaxy S5 had both a swappable battery and IP67. Tons of devices do. Glued construction was always about reducing manufacturing costs, not about an IP rating.
There are a few phones that have removable batteries with good water resistance. No phone is completely waterproof, so I don’t really care whether It can withstand 1 meter of water for 5 minutes verse 10 meters of water for an hour. It’s not like I am taking my phone snorkeling.
The Samsung S5 had an IP rating of 67, which can withstand temporary submersion and had removable batteries. I frigging loved that phone.
Galaxy S5 had a removable battery and IP67 and is a 2014 phone. The technology was there, so it has probably evolved enough in this 9 years.
Sony Xperia latest ones have headphone jack, IP rating for salt water, SD card, toolless sim tray and headphone jack. With a 4k screen. It’s absolutely fine. Manufacturers just don’t care.
I would rather have expandable storage mandated than replaceable batteries but obviously that’s not going to happen.
EU citizenship is a dream.
The fact that some of the gen Z crowd think it will be horrible have forgotten that it was much easier to carry 2 batteries and swap them out vs carrying a charger and cable with you everywhere. Pop in the new battery, power it on and carry on with you now full battery phone. Being tethered to a wall so you can have 10% from 20 minutes of charging is crazy.
Don’t forget the option to carry a 30lb battery bank everywhere with you so you’re at least tethered to something marginally more movable than a wall.
Seriously though, I miss my phone+battery in one charger and the ability to restart with full battery at around 4pm.
I know you are intentionally exaggerating a bit, but they do make pretty small portable chargers. I have an Anker PowerCore 5000, it has 1-2 full charges depending on your phone, and easily fits in a pocket
Yeah, definitely joking. Mine is 24,000 mAh and weigh less than 1.5lb allegedly.
I’d much rather just have a bigger battery. Replacement is more useful for longevity for me.
You’re not going to get a bigger battery though. Battery size is a pretty much maxed out, the only way to make a battery bigger would be to make the battery physically bigger. This would make the phone bigger / heavier. So it’s not going to happen.
If you are waiting on some magic new battery chemistry it’ll come along eventually but you’ll be waiting a while, and stubbornly not having a replaceable battery in the meantime isn’t going to make any difference.
There’s some huge battery breakthroughs going on right now. You’re right though, I would give it another 5 or so before they’re widespread among phones.
I used to do this. I thought it was awesome but I was literally the only person I ever knew who did this. It was not a popular thing to do.
Most people did not do this nor needed to since the very beginning of cell phones
We literally do not need replaceable batteries in 2023
Maybe, but you have to admit that battery live used to be longer (specially pre-smartphones), if your phone could comfortably last a couple of days there was less need to have portable power.
I fondly remember the convenience of having a flat, replaceable battery in my pocket even in the early Android days, and I’ve missed it ever since it went away.
Zero lemon had them so cheap that I had 4 extra batteries (they also had the extended batteries that would last forever but the cases were janky). I would keep one at work, one by the door to take with me and two at home if you include the one in my phone that I would swap out. I rarely charged my phone at all, just the batteries. I loved it.
The main reason I’m thinking of upgrading my mid-range phone now is the battery is on its last legs.
In fairness it’s lasted 6 years, which is two years more than my Nexus 4 got. Pokemon Go eventually killed that.
I don’t know when we all just collectively accepted that batteries should last one day and not a second more. Sure, it’s doing more than a Nokia 3310 ever did, but sometimes you really do need it to last more than that, like when travelling.
The problem with removable batteries is that you sacrifice water-proofness. That’s why iPhone batteries aren’t removable: Apple found that, on average, people prefer a water-proof phone over a replaceable battery. If you make the battery to removable, you can’t use sealants anymore, you’re just relying on a gasket.
Personally, I would rather have a phone that can handle being dropped in a sink full of dishes and am happy to pay $80 every 3 years to have the battery swapped.
So what about the iPhones pre IP68 certification? They never wanted this
As others have mentioned, the Galaxy S5 was water resistant and had a replaceable battery. Phones are generally not water proof, so don’t go dunking them in water expecting them to work. Use a case for that, also if it floats all the better.
Adding a sealant when you close it isn’t a huge chore, although it’s nice to be able to just replace the battery without any tools, it’s better than charging. Also it would still be water resistant until the first battery change.
Watches have replaceable batteries while having replaceable batteries, too.
As a side note, if you drop electronics in water, take the battery out before taking them out of the water, so that the short doesn’t destroy them. The battery will be toast, but that’s cheaper to replace.
Galaxy s5, all of the galaxy xcover phones. And also user removable in a sense that a user must be able to remove it with widely available tools or the tool must be provided. So manufacturers will probably start using screws and give you the screwdriver or something. Probably would also mean longer software upgrades since users probably would not feel the need to buy a new phone every time the battery dies.
This needs to be sooner, they 100% have the ability to adhere to this law after the next generation
I’d say that’s fantastic news.
Just waiting to see what’s going to go wrong between now and 2027 so that it won’t happen.
I think apple will comply by including a dongle battery that can be replaced but no one will actually carry with their phone
The law says, “Designing portable batteries in appliances in such a way that consumers can themselves easily remove and replace them;”
Key part being “in appliances”.
They know with whom they are dealing
Not a bad idea but there are flaws and this also doesn’t seem to address the issue of pricing or availability.
- So you can remove the battery, will you be able to buy one.
- They could prevent 3rd parties from making batteries that work.
- They could just not sell battery replacements.
- They could add more parts needed, like seals, screws that strip too easily, that annoying sticky tape etc.
This insufferable shit is exhausting
