Oh look, another reason not to buy BMW, I’ll just add it to the other 456788656752 reasons.
The problem is that once one manufacturer starts doing this, they’ll all do it, so you won’t even have the option of buying a new car without a subscription.
I’m so gonna install Linux on my future car
‘What do you mean the car is missing a driver?? Im sitting right here!’
Linux is always the answer.
If they’ll let you.
It probably already runs Linux, just hack it
I’d sooner hack the car
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What manufacturer? Name and shame.
CarPlay I can see if there’s an ongoing cost of making sure future Apple updates don’t break compatibility, but it’s very highly unlikely that will ever be an issue.
Name and shame, please. Also, did you get notified about all the subscriptions by the dealership? If yes, why did you still decide to buy it?
My job now requires my physical presence at one of their offices for compliance so in a very short time I had to buy a second car that could fit our budget. This was one of the few that could. Figured as a second car it wouldn’t be so bad.
Also the dealers swore up and down there would be no subscriptions but only after reading the fine print where these features are mentioned as “Complimentary for 36 months”
Did you call out the dealers on their lies?
And what exactly happens after I’ve signed all the papers?
“Hi yes I am mad that this car has hidden subscriptions for features I thought came standard but didn’t do enough due diligence to specifically verify each feature”
“Cool lol u signed up for payments so r u gonna continue making them or do we repossess it and tank ur credit rating?”
All I can do is not make the same mistake in the future.
Or just drive through the dealership’s front window and then declare “I’d like a refund, please”. A few of these occurring nationwide and they’d halt their bullshit.
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The Buick 3800 had a tube like that on top, it would crack from thermal stresses and piss out hot coolant. There was an aluminum aftermarket replacement like you describe but it was Dorman and a cheap fix. Buick also addressed the problem in later versions. I miss that engine.
I used to own a W124 series Benz (bought used for 5% of sticker price, I ain’t no fauntelroy). Nearly everything on it was redundant or excessively skookum.
When systems that weren’t as rugged started going down, like the vacuum controllers for doors or the 4matic computer etc, the car still worked safely with reduced convenience. A few minor design flaws like the wiring harness but that’s it. Room to work under the hood, too.
It was built in '93 when the engineers still ran the company.
Current main driver is the super reliable '03 CRV.
BMW’s are pure over engineered garbage.
Oh look, another reason not to buy
BMWa CARYeah I’ll just sprout wings and fly everywhere.
Please do if possible.
Seriously tho, was it so hard to understand that i was pointing out that all big car companies are starting to do this?
If this is a reason not to buy a BMW then its a reason not to buy any modern car. Which it is imo.
The problem is a huge number of cars were removed and destroyed which would otherwise have been in the used market. It’s a big reason why even used cars are priced so high. Buying used isn’t what it used to be.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_Allowance_Rebate_System
And they want to do it again not because it helped anyone get a car but because it let them make the prices so stupidly high.
I agree that new cars suck but they’re removing the stocks of used cars that would be worth buying at any price and at our expense.
Agree with that yep, its also already been shown years ago that modding used cars into electric cars is totally doable, economic and saves fuckloads of resources. Same thing happening with tractors too btw. Lots of farmers are buying up old tractors because they can actually repair them on site when they break down. With modern ones they have to wait for some asshole from john deer to come in with a debugging laptop to do the exact same thing for lots of money and downtime.
If once you do not succeed, just try again next year. They tried and backtracked putting heated seats behind a paywall not even a year ago see here.
Unless laws are made to make this fundamentally illegal, they’ll just keep pushing until it sticks. And once one manufacturer succeeds, they’ll all follow.
Since 2019 you have to pay 800$ a year to have your bmw use adaptive drive, 150$ to use the app.
Haha… connection to server cannot be established. Suspension resetting to default.
This is extra hilarious in the face of the crib manufacturer that just decided to subscription paywall basic functions of their crib… or the slow cooker… And that’s just this week.
Game manufacturers pulling the plug on games they sold removing the servers yanking the games.
And now people think that you can buy a product that is going to last longer and costs several orders of magnitude more… and you can only hope that the manufacturer can be bothered to:
- Keep the service safe and secure.
- Have it be reliable.
- Maintain it operational for the actual lifespan of the car (not some MBA’s definition of economic lifespan or something).
- Not fuck with you on the price. (We’re not shutting down the servers, but the price will be 50 a month and 5 euros per adjustment).
But the sale case is easy… lease car drivers. This way they can enjoy premium functions not incorporated into the sale price of the car. I hope the IRS that taxes these things sees through this ploy and taxes the vehicles for installed functions wether you pay for them or not. Saw this happen with Tesla’s… taxed based on their initial price… and then the user added 15k of functions after a day… and the tax was still based on the original sticker price.
At least in the case of games, the servers are an ongoing expense that adds value to the game. I want to play against other people online and provide by that costs ongoing expenses.
Oh you think this feature will function locally… I’ll bet this goes from their app to their servers first to verify subscription and then to your car. Someone needs to pay for the subscription verification platform.
Next up, Anti-lock brakes as a Subscription Service. ASS.
We are pirating car suspension now holy shit
You wouldn’t download a car
You wouldn’t download a configuration profile for your cars suspension!
People stealing owners’ property will be sent to the gulag!
TPB go brrrrrrrrrr
I would actually. A 1967 Shelby Cobra kit car if I had a choice.
Lmk if you find out how
Brick it by bios update:)))
This sure as fuck isn’t the best timeline, but it does have its moments
😂😂😂
These cars already cost more than my life, how can they ask for more money.
Because the people who buy them have it and BMW can get more out of them. The real problem is that they’ll buy it, and other manufacturers will see “hey, it’s a successful model and additional revenue generation!”
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In theory most subscription services provide additional content as time goes on. This only provides a capability that already exists on the car.
Scummy practices that should be outlawed, like retail stores raising prices just before a big sale so they can slap “80% off!” on their stuff.
EU is at least trying to do something about that. As of last year stores are required to display the cheapest price they’ve had for an item in the past three months when they have something on sale. Not all stores comply, and of course they try to get around these by the usual shenanigans, like basically the same product being available from the manufacturer with two slightly different item codes.
“We’re pivoting from serving peasants to fleecing rich dumbasses that subscribe and pay monthly fees for features built into the car.”
And they’ll make money doing it. Because there will never be a shortage of people with more money than sense.
eh, rich people car shop as well, and there is plenty of competition in that market. of course some people will still opt for BMW, we just have to hope enough go elsewhere to make them lose marketshare. but… it’s not looking good so far.
Ngl, i don’t see how bmw gets any sales when Mercedes exists. If you are actually rich a Mercedes is almost objectively the better vehicle, if you are just trying to show off the Mercedes is a better status symbol too.
You know it’s just a matter of time before this shit starts being applied to budget cars.
…I really hope the tech crowd is working on jailbreaking this garbage.
We try. We also pivot to open source to try and regain control because it’s the only way. We even share our passions with those who ask.
You folks just roll your eyes and put more money on their hands.
This “tech crowd” and “you folks” dichotomy is not helpful at all. Tell people how they can help, volunteer, donate etc, don’t wedge gaps between the same class fighting against the same ruling class. I’m a software engineer. I write open source software. I get that it’s tiring and you can see the worst in people when doing it, but we’re going to have to be better than that if we want to change things.
And for those reading like the top commenter, don’t sit on your hands and wait for “tech folks” to figure stuff out. It’s us vs. corporate greed, not “us hoping the tech folks save us from corporate greed” or “us tech folks being badgered like we should be some saviors against corporate greed.” Write your representatives to tell them this isn’t ok. Be mindful in your selection when you purchase a vehicle. Ask your tech savvy friends and family what you can do to help. You aren’t helpless in this, and as OP said, just sitting and waiting for something to be fixed or changed doesn’t help the overall goal.
dismissing our warnings as some nerd turf wars for decades aint helping anyone either.
What exactly do you propose the “normies” do? Is there some non-corporation making road-worthy cars? No? Let me guess, you want a family of 5 to bike 2 hours to the nearest school/park/grocery store in the snow on rural roads with no shoulder just to avoid paying a corporation? Take the nonexistent train?
who suggested bikes?
let me just say this: if facebook were known to be doing the shit it does today in 2002, it wouldnt have fucking flied, because normies trusted people more than they did corporations.
no need to make up that huge strawman.
That would be the ultimate way to stop this. Let them put the hardware in, and then not make a cent off it, because a third party enables it for the customer.
The level of subscriptions has become insane
In what way does the suspension require regular servicing or an online connection to a server to function? That would be the only reason to offer it as an ongoing service cost.
Otherwise, you’re just paying extra for something already in your car, not for an actual service, which would make no sense?
What next, paint ongoing service fees for having wheels? Not even for ensuring they’re regularly replaced, serviced, or repaired, just for the ability to use them at all…
Active suspension is software, just like Photoshop is. You need to pay subscription fee for Photoshop now, and BMW wants a subscription fee for their active suspension software too. Rent seeking and Enshittification.
Except that you have to have special way more expensive shocks to have adaptive suspension compared to fixed. It’s like being sold an I3 for the price of an I9 while being told you can pay a subscription to upgrade to the full performance
Btw, Intel has tried this practice before, and I believe still is doing it for some Xeons.
I feel like in this case it’s more like everyone gets sold i9 hardware, but can choose to pay the i3 price for it with locked out features, then decide later to pay the subscription to unlock the i7 or i9 performance.
At least with Photoshop (as bad as the model is), at least they are actually running the software and storing and backing up the associated data for it.
With the car, it’s all local to the car without BMW having to incur any expense for that functionality to keep going.
Id probably be angrier if this was some company making econoboxes, but if enshitification wants to target the cars of the rich, fuckin’ go for it.
The people driving those cars are probably closer to you than to the BMW CEO. They’re the same price as what trucks sell for these days and at some point they’ll reach the second-hand market and their price comes down quick.
True. I just bought a 1-year-old 330i, and it’s less than my wife’s Kia SUV (We live in Michigan, have three kids and two dogs, so it makes sense for us to have one big bus that can go off-road, else we’d have something smaller and electric). The BMW also costs far less than a pickup truck of the same age and mileage. US manufacturers have been transitioning out of the business of making sedans for years, because they’re not popular here. It is just a sea of SUVs and pickup trucks.
I do have a subscription to all kinds of “connected car” crap for the first year, but I’m going to turn all of that junk off when I make some other modifications later this year. I think the subscription is actually pretty cheap, but I just don’t want a bunch of spyware reporting back my location and speed.
Yeah, but they’re idiots
We long left the era where we “own” things that we buy. As everything is a computer now it has become very simple to control stuff that remotely that was working on its own before.
So the answer to “why would <CORPORATION> do this” is simply: “Because they can”.
Every tiny decision is guided by increasing profit. No matter the side effects (short or long term ). Because with many shareholders administering pressure to maximize profits there’s only one way to go (even if it’s a dumb and shortsighted decision) maximizing profits NOW. If you are not doing that because you can see that increasing profits now will hurt profits in the future then you are hindering the project. You have to increase profits now, because if you are not then your competitor is doing it and that is a problem. If you are not going with the project you will be out of a job sooner or later. Then someone will take over that will make the decision you couldn’t do.
This is a race to the bottom. Morals, integrity, honesty, responsibility and foresight are only obstacles in this logic (because the competition is not bound by them which gains them an advantage).
It’s simply cheaper now to build everything in the car always and run an operating system that manages all these things and can control what you are doing in your car.
Cory Doctorow held a great keynote about this some ~10-ish years (?) ago with the title “The coming war on general computation” where he explained the side effects of putting DRM in every stupid appliance. The side effect here is that we cannot hack our cars to switch on the heated seats (or whatever other feature BMW is not allowing us to use for free) because of DRM. It is not “our” car, even though we bought it.
I didn’t wake up this morning with the knowledge that I’m about to move to Pennsylvania and convert to being Amish.
This is a side effect of deregulation of both corporations and the stock market. I think that we’re going to see the pendulum swing towards more regulation and consumer-friendly policies here in the US. I don’t see that lasting for the long-term, though. There are too many vulnerabilities in the political system that allow asshole billionaires to manipulate it.
it’s not the system that is the problem, it’s the lack of class consciousness, in America the rich have it, but not the working class
Well done BMW. Anything that leads to more people cycling instead of driving is a good thing in my book.
People won’t switch from driving to cycling over this. They’ll just pick one of the several dozen other car manufacturers.
I suspect most BMW owners won’t care too much. Like they’ll find it annoying but still buy/lease the car anyway.
until every manufacturer implements it
What if the cycling option is a really REALLY good bike?
If the bike does the biking completely for me, has hvac, reclining seats, can do 65mph down the highway and can take care of my morning wood taking into account remaining travel time, I’d be interested. That indeed would be a really good bike.
Nobody’s gonna abandon cars as a whole over this, the same they wouldn’t abandon bicycles as a whole over some other outrageously monetized luxury feature they could live without.
Fucking LOL’d at this. Genuinely not sure if this is satire.
Sorry, your bicycle’s gear selector is locked into a single gear until you pay your subscription for the other gears.
Got it, don’t buy cars built after 2010.
Import something old and fun! Cars from smaller countries have lower mileage and can be cheap because they aren’t as valuable as a comparable car from the US. It isn’t hard to find a 25 year old car with about 50,000 miles on it.
JDM cars are especially nice now because of how weak the YEN is. Look outside the popular JDM cars and there are tons of things with easy to find parts for dirt cheap.
Or hell, get a not top trim of a popular model, and you can get something cheap. Want a station wagon built on the same platform as the Nissan Skyline? The Automatic Stageas are cheaper because tuners don’t want them because they’re an automatic and don’t have a turbo, which makes them slower, but also more reliable.
Nissan Rasheens with the 1500cc engine are easy to maintain and have an engine that was used in some American cars, get the first true AWD CUV for about $5000 plus import fees.
Another cheap option is a Toyota Caldina, get a reliable awd station wagon with a nice interior for 2 or 4 grand including import fees. (Avoid the 2000ish GTT version with a turbo, turbo manifold is prone to warping on that engine and said manifold is hard to find in the US as those engines generally didnt sell in the US)
Where are you finding things like this? What’s parts availability like?
Carfromjapan.com has the best search features I’ve found, once you know what you’re looking for https://www.goo-net-exchange.com/ is also nice because they translate the car condition sheets.
Parts availability depends on the car. For the Rasheen for example most of the engine parts can be found at any parts store for the 1500 and 2000 cc engine versions cause those engines were also in American cars. I’ve also found English websites that are easy to order just about any parts you want for a Rasheen including body panels.
Amazon is also nice for finding parts, I was able to find parts for a SR18DE engine on Amazon and that engine was never sold in America. So you can just buy the parts yourself then take the car to a local mechanic for the work.
Once you find something that interests you just Google that car name parts and you can usually find someone talking online about how owning that car has been for them.
The best listings also have video of the car running so you can hear if something is off with it.
Not necessarily. My 2015 SEAT (for folks in the North America: That’s basically Volkswagen) is one of the latest cars that do not completely fuck you over. TPMS is passive, so you don’t need expensive sensors. You can also update the maps on your own (OK, here they pull you over if you don’t know the simple trick). Parts are also cheap.
no, SEAT IS VW
Probably safe up to 2016 as long as it’s not luxury brand
One of our cars is a 2016 GM and I just unscrewed the cell antenna instead of ripping out the cell module. Tracking disabled, or at least unreliable. The subscription nav is useless and easy to ignore. I would like to figure out how to prevent the siriusxm ads built into the infotainment system, still.
I look forward to better infotainment hacks down the road.
Got it, thanks
big oil licking their lips and nodding their heads
Are there any electric cars that aren’t glorified smartphones on wheels? Something a grandma can drive without ending up in the wrong menu.
The Bolt is ok. It has a screen and Android Auto and stuff, but I only use it for Android Auto navigation and energy stats when I’m curious. For pretty much everything else, there are good ol’ fashioned buttons
My wife used to drive an electric Smart Car for her work. It had a range of 60 miles (less in the winter), and she called it a glorified golf cart. But it was perfect for the 20 or so miles she’d drive each day.
“The pressure eased off a little when they ended subscriptions tied to heated seats, but the Internet rage machine has come back for vengeance.”
lol. It’s not vengeance or rage, its simply the fact that making someone pay for something they already own is dumb.
When you need fitgirl to help you with your car.
Or an Empress. Just stay off the Telegram channel FFS.
Idk, it’s almost entertaining watching her lose her mind.
If I want drama I’ll get a Husky… Otherwise I’ll pass.
Sure, but a husky will tear up your couch.
Fuxking legend
