I want to give them money but since my childhood my parents pretty much told me that they are all either faking it or are too lazy to go to work for money. I mean, I guess they can go to work but not everyone gets accepted to work as easy as it sounds like.
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Instead, you should try and help passing laws and regulations to help them in your region.
no, because -
In the EU, for example 2016 a law has been made so everyone may create a basic bank account, even if they are homeless or foreigners
that is literally less than bare minimum and only provides help to those already getting support (applying for benefits takes much more than a bank account, without additional support, and a societal framework to end homelessness instead of making it “more manageable”, being able to get an account is still useless).
The only action any individual can take to end homelessness is to become an active anti-capitalist, since as long as capitalism exists, so will homelessness.
Having empathy is normal, yes.
While some people do fake it or some people may actually be too lazy, on the whole attributing homelessness to personality flaws or moral failings is just a coping strategy for lots of people - lies they tell themselves to make the situation be despicable instead of pitiful. Most homeless people aren’t faking it, and most homeless people wouldn’t be homeless if they had any choice in the matter. Many of them are homeless due to poor or temporary circumstances, many others due to mental health issues combined with lacking a support system.
This is the one of very few remotely empathetic takes here and it still feels a need to preface with “some people do fake it”.
I am hoping I stumbled upon a meme, because if not, holy crap.
Some beggars do indeed see it as a job and make substantial money, that is just a fact. Doesn’t mean that there are not people in real desperate situations and needing any help they can get.
It’s a normal human trait, which is why it’s so easily taken advantage of. If you wish to do something for your local population of people suffering homelessness there are plenty of charities to donate time or money to that will ensure it is spent more wisely than most any singular person suffering from homelessness would likely spend it themselves.
ensure it is spent more wisely than most any singular person suffering from homelessness would likely spend it themselves.
Right, because being homeless means a person couldn’t possibly know what’s best for them, best treat them like children, there’s no other way! It’s not like literally the majority of people are a missed pay check or two away from becoming homeless themselves, it’s truly amazing how in that instance a person, according to you, suddenly loses all faculties of their mind… 🙄
They’ve not necessarily lost faculties of their mind, nor do I disparage those suffering from homelessness. They’re humans, people just like you and me, but they often suffer from addiction and mental illnesses that would make financing them directly a negative impact in their lives. So how about you think about the compliexites of problems and how to actually solve them instead of getting rage baited like an upset Karen? (upwards of 40% abuse alcohol statistically Source: https://www.addictionhelp.com/addiction/homelessness/ and 20-30% suffer from mental illness Source: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/mind-matters-menninger/202105/the-complex-link-between-homelessness-and-mental-health)
If you want, try to help such people.
It might surprise you that you can dump unlimited money into certain people and they’ll end up back in the same situation, but they’ll hate you for not giving more because you still have something left.
It’s like trying to help a drowning person, they often will drag you into the water with them.
I mean, just give them money?
Put it this way: getting a job is just one of many challenges facing homeless people.
For example, if you get a job but are already living absolutely hand-to-mouth, can you actually afford to have that first month of work with no money coming in on a day by day basis. If you cannot afford to even eat how will you make it to that first paycheck?
Even if you do, where will your job put that money? Many, many homeless people do not have a bank account, and what do you need to open a bank account? A home address and ID!
Were you fortunate enough to become homeless with a copy of your birth certificate or other form of ID? If not oh that’s not a problem sir, it’ll cost you £35, and then it’ll arrive by recorded delivery to your home address. Where was that again?
Pretty much no person is homeless by choice. Most are there by a combination of bad luck, violence, a lack of a social security net, mental illness, and many many other factors. Very few people would choose a life of danger and unprovoked violence. You wouldn’t want to be without a home, they don’t want to be without a home for the exact same reasons.
So in conclusion, it is the very basics of human decency to feel bad for them. I would urge you to go further and try to help them, whether that be by direct contribution, by volunteering, by donating to a housing charity, or something else.
I give to my local shelter, spreads out the aid while being less likely to be spent on drugs(so long as your shelter is trustworthy)
I like Kant’s take on this. He argued (roughly, by memory) that giving to people begging on the street directly was a selfish act, as it’s satisfying our own need to feel better about ourselves more than the needs of the homeless population, and would lead to an unfair distribution giving more money to those who are talented at evoking empathy rather than those that might need it the most. He argued that the unselfish thing to do would be to donate to the cause indirectly, responding not to the emotional response in the moment but to a rational consideration of the needs of the homeless population.
I think he has a point. That said, there’s nothing wrong with being selfish every now and then, especially not if your selfishness gives someone a warm meal. And empathy is a healthy human reaction.
Your parents seem to have failed to grasp the challenges facing the homeless population. A better take would be “don’t give that guy money, start donating regularly to a local charity instead and help make sure that help is given to all those who need it”.
Oh, and also, rally for political change.
Kant had a point there, but I think he also fails to address the problem.
The existence of charitable organizations means that the government has failed that group of people. Charitable organizations are extremely inefficient and sometimes are prone to the exact problems he brings up with donating directly to individuals, or they may prioritize certain individuals with certain religious beliefs over others.
Charitable organizations need to be folded and replaced with government programs. We don’t need to be paying CEOs salaries when we’re just trying to help someone on the street.
You trust the government enough to properly provide for those most in need, but the government has pushed the work onto the very charities that you are arguing against. The government leaks tens of billions annually on preserving the needs of the richest members of our society, a quarter of which could have made a massive impact on world hunger.
I don’t think the government or private organizations generally have anyone’s best interest in mind when they do what they do, besides those who have the most influence.
I’ve been involved as a treasurer for a number of “medium” charities in Australia. Most recently one providing free legal services to the disadvantaged, and another running a refuge for homeless youth.
As an aside, bear in mind that I as a treasurer as well as the entire board are volunteers - well qualified and experienced professionals donating their time to ensure that the organisation is run efficiently and is maximising the benefit to the community.
Your comments really grind my gears. They’re born of shallow social media type thinking. These falsehoods are commonly used as a “reason” why one ought not to donate to charities.
Certainly there are overpaid CEOs, but these are a minority. Recently the charity running the refuge got a new CEO. He had been a police superintendent. He took a pay cut of about two thirds in order to be our CEO. He said that he had spent most of his career locking people up, and wanted to spend the last part of his career changing kids trajectories before they got involved with the law.
Imagine saying that this organisation would be more efficient of it were subsumed by the government, so the CEO-equivalent could be paid 3x as much.
I read @bustrpoindextr as not criticizing the charities directly, but rather reflect that they represent a systematic failure of government structures. We shouldn’t need homeless shelters or soup kitchens - there shouldn’t be homelessness or hunger. Taxation and sensible public spending should render charity unnecessary.
Which is a nice thought - I wouldn’t judge people for giving their money to political interest organizations promoting solidarity rather than directly to charities.
It’s a fine balance between patching the flaws of the system and trying to replace it all together. In some extreme cases charity might make the system just bearable enough that it’s not overthrown, which might occasionally do more harm than good in the long run.
Government programs are literally no better when it comes to administrative costs. In fact way worse in the vast majority of cases.
CEO’s are only a thing with very large charities on the order of the Red Cross, (or rich people money laundering charities). Your local shelter or food bank isn’t going to be having a high overhead, in fact it’s going to be much lower than the government agencies because of almost entirely free volunteer work. The point where the government is more efficient is due to the fact that welfare fraud is a crime, so people are naturally less inclined to lie to receive benefits.
The thing about “Don’t do X, because we SHOULD do Y”
Is that nobody’s doing Y, and we’re nowhere close to getting there, so, until we are, we should support the X.
You say that you feel bad, and that your parents have taught you this all your life, so I assume you’re young and won’t be too hard on you but to put it bluntly - that is a terrible and ignorant take, even though it’s a feature, not a bug (and one that could impact your own family just as easily).
Homeless people are still people.
Many homeless people are in work, but even if they aren’t, and gasp even if they use drugs (which I know you’ve never considered why they use, or have been in a situation where your life is that hard your only chance to rest from it for a minute is by doing drugs), and even if they use whatever money they get to buy those drugs, they deserve the same basic decency and agency you would show any other human being. 9 times out of 10 they’ll be using the money to pay for a room in a shelter for the night or some food of their choosing (which you’d know if you’d ask them).
Giving a homeless person money (or even the nod you’re so averse to) lets them know that another human has seen them, and has seen them as a fellow human, not some crap on the street to be ignored or looked down on because they make you feel bad.
Once you start placing conditions on your kindness/donation (“no money they’ll use it for drugs”, or “here, have this stale food I’ve been carrying around for weeks in case I run in to someone like you. your dietary requirement, never mind likes or dislikes are irrelevant to me!”, or even “let me buy you something to eat”), you’re making it about you, taking away the last bit of agency many of these people have, and completely lose sight of the person you claim you want to help. At that point - walk away, the only person who might benefit is you, which means you’ve used a homeless person to boost your own ego.
The best advice I could give you is to start talking to people who already support homeless people. Once you’ve hopefully gained some understanding of homelessness and a little empathy to those dealing with it, then and only then could you start talking to directly to homeless people, as I said above, even if you can’t give them money, the sincere acknowledgment that they exist and are as deserving as anyone else of human interaction and kindness will show them that at least someone cares.
That is why soliciting / begging for money works. It makes people uncomfortable and they give money. It wouldn’t work if we all didn’t feel that.
Oh yeah, those damn cunning homeless people, there to make you uncomfortable with their suffering… (in case it isn’t clear - heavy sarcasm, your attitude is disgusting)
There wasn’t any judgement implied there. It literally works because people have empathy, you know, that thing that makes you not immediately assume everyone else has the absolute worst intentions.
Well, I was merely stating a fact.
It all depends how that plays out. Empathy is a good thing. It’s why were not sociopaths and our species died a long time ago. It can also be exploited by people. I mean there are organized gangs sending out people to beg for money on the streets. Especially around christmas time. I wouldn’t give them any money but I have donated to proper people in need.
I don’t really like it if people play with empathy. For example showing starving african children is something that works and non-profits do it to get people’s attention. Nonetheless it reinforces stereotypes and leads to a spiral of more and more graphic images being needed. It’s a complicated topic. This year I looked for a non-profit who doesn’t do this, lets people have their dignity and also spend less of the donations for their own corporation and more for the actual projects.
I believe also with homeless people it’s more complicated than one of the extremes. Some just pretend to be homeless. Some really are. And really in need. Some will waste your money for alcohol and some need a warm sleeping bag to get through the night. There is probably more than meets the eye. And it’s always difficult to tell.
But I get your interjection. Some people really think the homeless people should be kept out of sight so they themselves don’t have to feel uncomfortable. That’s disgusting.
(Edit: Something I think works somewhat alright is charities who give out food on the street, warm clothes and sleeping bags. Maybe this is unlikely to get abused and you can donate to them without worrying too much.)
I believe also with homeless people it’s more complicated than one of the extremes. Some just pretend to be homeless. Some really are. And really in need. Some will waste your money for alcohol and some need a warm sleeping bag to get through the night. There is probably more than meets the eye. And it’s always difficult to tell.
Nobody who is doing well is sitting outside in December begging for change. It’s dehumanising. If someone is down on their luck and wants a beer to get through then it’s not a waste.
Personally we have some good homeless charities around here so I tend to report them using an app which brings out volunteers to help them get supplies, a hostel, and benefits which is more money than I can spare, but if I have food or drink (including sometimes alcohol) going I usually donate that too.
It’s important to put yourself in their shoes.
I don’t know how it is where you people all live. In big european cities it has happened that criminal networks force people to beg on the street. You’re probably right that they are not well. Sometimes this involves human trafficking. But they’re not the usual homeless people. The gangs will “recruit” for example amputees and people that get sympathy. The money usually doesn’t stay with those people. It’s organized crime and the money is taken from them. You ocassionally/rarely see dubious people when you visit a christmas market. Police cracks down on things like this but you can google a good amount of news articles on this.
However there are homeless people. And it’d be a shame if we stopped helping them because of this. But you also don’t want to support criminals.
And I don’t think it’s the same in the US anyways. Social security, healthcare and everything is very different. So it what kind of organized crime we have.
If people are being human trafficked they’re not doing well.
This idea that all homeless people are fronts for gangs however is a right wing idea that rarely or never plays out. A gang can make money drug dealing, stealing cars, even petty theft, all are going to pay much higher amounts than sitting in the train station begging for change.
I’m completely with you on that. Criminals are also known for doing pickpocketing on christmas markets. All of that isn’t that big a problem where I live and this hasn’t happened to me, yet. But I know people. I think it’s obvious that seasonally crowded places are bound to attract some criminals. And all of that doesn’t really have to do anything with homeless people. But I will gladly rethink the stereotypes I heard and think about where I got that from. Sounds like something right-wing people would love to regurgitate.
Yes, it’s normal to feel like shit about driving past the homeless, that’s your humanity working.
We are not faster or stronger than bears, so we evolved to work together as tribes.
Seeing other humans abandoned by your own tribe should make us feel bad.
No, it is not YOUR individual responsibility to assist others beyond your own means. Retiring in the U.S. costs millions of dollars and that may seem far away for some, but time comes for us all and most can’t afford to help others with their oxygen mask before putting on our own.
When I drive by someone who needs help, knowing I’m not equipped to help them, I get angry at every politician and lobbyist whose life work is making sure meaningful social programs never get started.
My responsibility is to vote for the most humanitarian candidate possible at every opportunity, and to share my values of “people first” any way I can.
We all struggle, and the struggles of others doesn’t disqualify your own. It’s healthy to spend your personal resources on your personal problems, and use your social/political power (vote) to address social/political problems.
Props on being a human being.
Yeah, it’s pretty normal for someone that has empathy to feel bad when they can’t do much/anything to help someone else that they would help if they could.
The problem is that you can’t help everyone, so you’d have to pick and choose which individuals you do help, which is going to make you feel just as bad as not giving them any money at all.
The real answer to resolving the feeling is to provide help in a more general fashion. Volunteering with any of the local homeless support programs/charities is a good way to help individuals and homeless people in general
If you can’t do that, or do other support that’s similarly broad, that’s okay. Just do what you can, when you can.
Yes, it just means you’re human. I feel bad about it too, but I don’t keep change in my car. I do what I can by supporting food banks and rescue missions* in my region that have homeless outreach, because its what I can do.
- yes I know these are religious organizations that are no doubt trying to convert/‘save’ people which is why I confirm through Charity Navigator they are also fulfilling their obligations to the poor. Like Jesus would do.
Sorry to tell you but your parents are assholes who lack basic empathy.
Must be hard being so much better than everyone else.
Where exactly did I say I was? I simply stated a fact, is all …
SMR has already admitted they lack empathy elsewhere in the thread so no surprise you made then feel attacked.
I hope so.
