I was on Debian Sid for a year or 2 and gaming was working perfectly until I did an update that uninstalled my GUI and WiFi drivers. I’m on Mint now and it’s been smooth sailing so far

Volume is cubic (r^3) and surface area is quadratic (r^2)

I’m glad you found a natural computer to post with from inside your natural house. Seeing your dogshit opinions is funny.

Appeals to nature are not compelling because all of human progress and civilisation is built upon using technology to surpass nature. Just about everything we interact with in modern society isn’t natural, why would we think that your idea of humans natural diet would be the ideal?

Veganism is an ethical stance, not religious. There are plenty of ethical stance that place restrictions on human behaviour that I’m sure you are totally on with, like when society tells you not to steal from or murder people. Are you prepared to argue against ethics as a whole?

The argument is that breeding more animals for the enjoyment of humans is bad, but the existing animals should be given as good of a life as we can. Since rescuing does not directly support the breeders, some vegans are OK with rescuing to give these animals a better life. Some vegans use similar logic to thrift wool sweaters for yarn, when they would not support buying new wool.

Taurine is usually singled or because it is the only nutrient required to meet the AACFO cat food guidelines that can not be readily sourced directly from plants.

Taurine is an essential amino acid for cats that is present in animal products. During the manufacturing process of cat food, it is heated to high temperature and some odds this natural taurine is destroyed. To make up for this, synthetic taurine is added back in. This synthetic taurine is made in a lab, and (from wikipedia) in 1993, 5000-6000 tonnes were produced.

If you have any more questions, or any studies or other academic sources I should look at, please don’t hesitate to post them.

Happy to see someone who read through the analysis! I just looked back at your criticism and you make stone goods points. I did notice that almost all the negative effects are coming from the same citation in the study, so I looked into the study they are citing there. Here’s a link to the PDF of that study.

The main take away for me from this study is that they were feeding the cats a “vegetarian human diet,” specifically casserole mince along with a couple others. Feeding these cats a diet designed for humans is obviously bad, but it doesn’t speak to commercial food designed for cats. You can use this to say that a homemade vegan diet is not good for cats. I’ve always said, don’t do a homemade diet for your pets.

There were also negative outcomes from citation 30, but the full text is behind a paywall, so I can’t really check on it. Of anyone has a copy I’d love to read it.

The studies that did use commercially available cat foods (literally all the other studies linked) found that the cats fed a vegan diet were within the range for regular healthy cats.

I am not making the claim that vegan diet is healthier. I am not claiming that you can make your own cat food at home. My specific claim is that there is not a statistically significant difference in the health of cats that eat commercially available vegan cat food. If you have a similar quality study to the contrary, please post it. Until that happens, I’m going to stick with the researchers who published the study, when they say:

Perhaps a take-home message is that use of commercially prepared vegan pet foods appear to be safe for use in cats and dogs but further research is needed.

For the record, science disagrees with you. According to an analysis of all current research, there is no statistically significant difference of cat heath when fed a nutritionally sufficient vegan diet. Of there is a similarly high quality study that finds that a nutritionally sufficient vegan diet is worse for cats I would love to see it.

The vegan diet we are talking about isn’t a bunch of vegetables, it’s a manufactured dry food specifically designed to have all the nutrients a cat needs.

People often use the obligate carnivore excuse, but use it in an unscientific way. Obligate carnivores have nutritional needs that can only be meet through meat in the wild, but humans are perfectly capable of manufacturing these nutrients. We are so good at it that we supplement these synthetic nutrients in meat based cat food already.

This is a contentious issue for most people, and it can be hard when you are very passionate about something to look at the evidence and change your opinion. I’ve looked at a decent number of studies on the topic recently, and they all seen to point to the conclusion that a diet without meat can be healthy for cats, so long as it contains all the nutrients they need.

I would love to have more research done into these diets. I totally understand not being fully convinced by the currently available studies, I get a bit annoyed when other commenters say is scientifically impossible without doing any research into it. For me personally, the available studies are convincing enough that I would want to hear of a reason that cats are not able to get the nutrients they need from the specially designed kibble.

I can agree that there is a pretty big jump in the differences from meat based to plant based food for wet food, but the jump seems smaller to me for dry food. My understanding is that with dry food, most of the meat flavour and some of the nutrients are lost in the processing of the food, and they have to suppliment the lost nutrients and spray a flavouring agent on to make it appealing to cats.

I think we all just wasn’t what’s best for our cats. I think that a the moment meat is cheaper, more easily available, and better researched than the plant based diets and I totally understand going for that option

Would an analysis of all current research be enough evidence? They conclude that there is no significant difference of cat heath when fed a nutritionally sufficient vegan diet.

The vegan diet we are talking about isn’t a bunch of vegetables, it’s a manufactured dry food specifically designed to have all the nutrients a cat needs.

The obsession with “natural diet” is bizarre in the first place. Are you feeding your cat small songbirds and mice, or are you feeding them dry food made with meat they never would be ankle to hunt for in the wild?

This is a contentious issue for most people, and it can be hard when you are very passionate about something to look at the evidence and change your opinion. I’ve looked at a decent number of studies on the topic recently, and they all seen to point to the conclusion that a diet without meat can be healthy for cats, so long as it contains all the nutrients they need.

Cook serve delicious 3?!

Very fun and hectic

the science is clear that most vegans have nutritional deficiencies

Source?

From my experience, it takes about the same effort to get a nutritionally complete diet as a vegan as a carnist. The difference tends to be that people compare their current, shitty diet to an unnecessarily restrictive vegan diet.